1. 109
  1.  

  2. 43

    Hello friends! (And thanks jcs for the invite.)

    I’m the author of this OS and I’m happy to answer any questions you might have about it :)

    If you don’t have any questions that’s okay too, I’ll just say thanks for checking out my project!

    1. 4

      How long did you work on the project before making the first commit? As I understand it you had EXT2 filesystem support and some other things before you committed?

      1. 8

        They were in separate repos at first, so I can tell you! I spent 7 days writing the initial ext2 implementation, and 2 days writing an ELF loader. I’m less sure about the initial kernel, as I wrote that with very little structure while going through a rough period, but a couple of weeks.

      2. 4

        Very cool stuff. How many man hours went into this?

        1. 4

          All of my free time in the last year, basically. I was unemployed for the first 6 months of the project, so I was working full time on this, 7 days a week. After that I got a job which slowed me down a bit. I still like to imagine that I’m keeping decent pace though. :)

        2. 3

          Amazing! I’m curious, how long did you work on it before importing it into git, and are you at all concerned about burnout at this pace?

          1. 2

            pretty incredible, congrads! in my most productive coding years, I am pushing 80-90K lines of code (business apps). But you seem to be doing quite a bit more, and more complexity!.

            What’s your technical background, and what if any ‘philosophy/principles’ do you have for the OS?

            1. 13

              Hey vladislavp! My technical background is being a self-taught high school dropout who learned C++ from open source development (KDE) and then worked at Nokia (Qt project) and Apple (WebKit). Nowadays I work at a small research lab in Sweden and do this project with my free time. :)

              Long version, if someone is interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncTesyJsDvU

          2. 10

            Wow that’s a remarkable amount of progress in one year.

            1. 2

              Déjà vu with that guy who made the closed source SkyOS in late 90s early 00s, the remarkable progress made in very short time.

              Many interensting OS projects going on back then. AtheOS/Syllable, MenuetOS, SkyOS, OpenBeOS/Haiku…

              1. 3

                Back then, computers took forever to boot, apps were a pain to install, things kept getting slower, etc. All on hardware with a fraction of today’s resources. The SkyOS demo showed a fast boot, installing apps was right-click install, the system was snappy, and the author(s) redid everything including audio/video. I was hoping it made it or went out open source.

                Most links are gone with only a few vids in Youtube. Although initially confused, I remembered that the demo vids were mpg’s on the web site. Archive has tons of scrapes. I picked a random one later in development. Here’s the About, Tour, some screenshots, and the last vid on Youtube from “Mom Tries…” channel.

                Wonder what author is doing now. Might be worth trying another run at getting him to open-source it, dual-license it, or sell it for a reasonable fee to then open-source. For historical reasons and/or use on older boxes.

                1. 3

                  Heh, a lot of the quotes in that youtube video are from the old Wikipedia SkyOS article I wrote. As a teenager I was obsessed with alternative operating systems and I was particularly active in the SkyOS community.

                  Szeleney is making mobile games now under a company he founded called Djinnworks. I would love to see the source released, and I’d love to have an archive of skyos.org, which had a decade of great blog content and a vibrant forum community.

                  1. 3

                    Well, your quotes are about all the made it to a video. So, thanks!

                    Djinnworks, eh? I’ll keep it bookmarked in case I see a chance to talk to him about it later.

            2. 7

              I consider myself as a pretty decent developer. But I could never do this. At least not in a year. It would take me an order of magnitude longer. To me, this is some pretty amazing stuff. I haven’t been as impressed with anything since… I don’t know. Maybe since I saw the Quake II renderer for the first time…

              1. 4

                Damn! That is an insane amount of work! Did the author of this work on it like every single day? I guess some people play video games and read books, and this person wrote a whole operating system. Really more than just an OS, we’re talking kernel, frame buffer, a really neat GUI toolkit (that was written parallel on Linux first), porting some other tools into it, support for multi processes and process monitoring. Very cool.

                1. 9

                  Hi djsumdog! If you check my GitHub history you’ll find that yes, I work on this basically every single day :) I do miss playing video games, but I’m really proud of how far the system has come in one year. It’s been worth it!

                  1. 1

                    [wrong comment]

                2. 4

                  This is pretty impressive! I can’t even find the time to do Linux From Scratch never mind write my own!

                  1. 4

                    As $random_internet_dude, I welcome these new operating systems written from scratch. Why praise diversity everywhere and suddenly fear it for software? Replicated efforts? In that case, even though there might have been efforts, it sounds more like duplicated fun.

                    1. 5

                      Beautiful work. This kind of hobby project is so pure. I wonder if the dev is going for full POSIX compliance.

                      Semi-related quote:

                      Computer science would have progressed much further and faster if all of the time and effort that has been spent maintaining and nurturing Unix had been spent on a sounder operating system. We hope that one day Unix will be relinquished to the history books and museums of computer science as an interesting, albeit costly, footnote.

                      I love UNIX, maybe because I’m used to it, but I keep wondering what an OS building on what made *nix great without *nix grievances would be.

                      1. 7

                        I love UNIX, maybe because I’m used to it, but I keep wondering what an OS building on what made *nix great without *nix grievances would be.

                        This is exactly the intent of Plan 9; your mileage may vary on if it succeeds at its goals.

                        There are also non-Unix ways of thinking, but these were (IMHO, falsely) discredited by the sheer market and cultural powers of Unix.

                        1. 4

                          This is exactly the intent of Plan 9; your mileage may vary on if it succeeds at its goals.

                          I’ve tried it and it’s not for me. Plus the community is weird and unwelcoming.

                          There are also non-Unix ways of thinking, but these were (IMHO, falsely) discredited by the sheer market and cultural powers of Unix.

                          What are you referring to exactly? I’m interested in your thoughts about this.

                          1. 6

                            I have a few non-UNIX ways of thinking in this list that you might find interesting.

                            1. 3

                              There is Jehanne, which started as a Plan 9 fork — you might find it interesting. The website for the project has some good write-ups as well.

                              1. 3

                                What a sad state of affairs. I read the pieces on the Harvey OS side of the story, that’s enough to demotivate you completely.

                                1. 3

                                  This is an interesting read too and hopefully I’m not breaking any rules by linking it.

                              2. 3

                                This may give you some idea.

                                https://web.mit.edu/~simsong/www/ugh.pdf

                                1. 2

                                  I’ve read it :) the quote above is from this book.

                              3. 4

                                In my preferred alternate reality, VMS discredited UNIX.

                                I’d still rather use VMS than UNIX today for almost any non-trivial production task.

                                “One of the questions that comes up all the time is: How enthusiastic is our support for UNIX?

                                “Unix was written on our machines and for our machines many years ago. Today, much of UNIX being done is done on our machines. Ten percent of our VAXs are going for UNIX use. UNIX is a simple language, easy to understand, easy to get started with. It’s great for students, great for somewhat casual users, and it’s great for interchanging programs between different machines. And so, because of its popularity in these markets, we support it. We have good UNIX on VAX and good UNIX on PDP-11s.

                                “It is our belief, however, that serious professional users will run out of things they can do with UNIX. They’ll want a real system and will end up doing VMS when they get to be serious about programming.

                                “With UNIX, if you’re looking for something, you can easily and quickly check that small manual and find out that it’s not there.

                                With VMS, no matter what you look for – it’s literally a five-foot shelf of documentation – if you look long enough it’s there. That’s the difference – the beauty of UNIX is it’s simple; and the beauty of VMS is that it’s all there.”

                                • Ken Olsen
                                1. 1

                                  Unix was free/cheap, VMS was expensive.

                                  Also, what’s wrong with Windows (NT)? ;)

                                  1. 2

                                    Worse really is better, when it’s free.

                                    1. 1

                                      “Also, what’s wrong with Windows (NT)? ;)”

                                      It was the successor to VMS designed by the same people tweaking and improving on the same internals. So, Ken Olsen’s arguments naturally apply to it, too. ;)

                                  2. 2

                                    O3ONE was one attempt by one amateur enthusiast to build a hobbyist VMS-like rather than UNIX-like system.

                                    The project pages are up but it hasn’t been updated since 2004.

                                    It might be a fun thing to fork and work on.

                                    Edit: VMS became OpenVMS when they added support for POSIX system calls to their kernel and enhanced portability with “open systems”. There was the FreeVMS project, now defunct, which was working on a clone the opposite way, by adding VMS system calls and features to a POSIX/UNIX-like (Linux) kernel, and building on those to clone the standard VMS libraries and system services.

                                    They did have a decent DCL and SMG$ and, if I recall correctly, a working BLISS compiler.

                                  3. 4

                                    HelenOS is a very interesting portable multicore multiserver microkernel research operating system that isn’t a UNIX clone and is not built to be compatible with existing systems, though they do provide enough compatibility to support porting most C11/C++14 applications and libraries, but it’s certainly not UNIX-like.

                                    It’s development is driven by various academic research projects rather than a vision or roadmap, so it will likely never be a production system, but it’s interesting nonetheless to look at a modern non-UNIX design.

                                  4. 3

                                    > writes operating system from scratch with no limits or forced compatibility in terms of design and functionality > makes it look like Windows 95

                                    Jokes aside, @awesomekling, great work on this! Keep it up and be brave to try out new ideas! Don’t be stuck in the “old” models, even though they might be dominating the GUI on all major platforms.

                                    1. 4

                                      Hey FRIGN! I’m definitely trying out some new ideas, like the /proc filesystem using JSON to make exchanging data between kernel and userspace really pleasant. One of the other developers, Sergey Bugaev, has introduced system support for Markdown which we now use for the built-in man pages. Just two random things I quite like about the system.

                                      As far as the GUI goes though, I really like the style so far, although I wish my icon drawing skills would improve faster :)

                                      1. 1

                                        These hand sign for SIGSTOP and SIGCONT are great though. :)

                                    2. 2

                                      I just recently found out about this project, specifically via his YouTube channel. It’s worth checking out, if only to see how other people write code. One though should probably go through chronologically, because when I tried to watch a random video, there was too much API I wasn’t familiar with (on top of C++).