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    CSS dismissal is about exclusion, not technology css culture zendev.com
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    If you haven’t clicked the article already, it essentially boils down to: if you’re not a proponent of CSS in front-end design, you’re a misogynist.

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      That’s definitely a strawman.

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        That is very much not what it says. The argument is “both technical choices are valid in some situations, so many of the people who are arguing one side are doing so for sexist reasons.” You may disagree with that claim, but your summary is just plain wrong.

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          definitely a good faith reading of the article, please continue to add more substantive insights like this.

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            I usually peek at the comments before reading the articles, this time I didn’t and I paid for it… (with neurons)

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                I believed this for quite some time. In order to develop even a basic web application, the number of technologies you have to learn first is frightening. Web browsers have grown in complexity to the point that they are basically operating systems in their own right. That the ecosystem works at all is simply amazing. I figured a decade ago that something “better” would have replaced the web for applications by now but here I sit wrong as always. :)

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                It’s about gender privilege and exclusion.

                …Well that was an oddly dumb take.

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                  “This is a complex technical field with nontrivial trade-offs in time and expressiveness! I know, let’s tie it to gender politics and Critical Theory! That’ll solve everything!” — The least likely sentence in the Universe.

                  Next up is “Rust: Is Ownership a Reactionary Plot?”

                  Edit: OK, this author tipped their hand a bit too much at the end:

                  Let’s call a spade a spade.

                  This is an outright racist dog-whistle, and isn’t even subtle. I can’t just play along anymore if that’s the level of humor on display. I’ll leave my jokes (such as they are) but I have to call that much out, at least.

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                    This is an outright racist dog-whistle, and isn’t even subtle.

                    Isn’t it? I had no idea until (prompted by your comment) I googled around and found how it’d acquired those implications recently in America. It’s used in Australia without any such nuance, and presumably other countries too. I wouldn’t be quick to assert that it’s a dog whistle, especially not in an article that’s being criticised for leaning too hard in the social justice direction.

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                      I wouldn’t be quick to assert that it’s a dog whistle, especially not in an article that’s being criticised for leaning too hard in the social justice direction.

                      That’s one thing which makes me conclude it’s meant in a racist fashion: The article does lean too hard in a social justice direction, as if it were written by someone trying to discredit that viewpoint by making it look ridiculous, or at least have some fun at its expense.

                      Any viewpoint has honest adherents who can make it look ridiculous all on their own, but the combination of factors here made me conclude it is, in fact, a racist dog-whistle.

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                        as if it were written by someone trying to discredit that viewpoint by making it look ridiculous, or at least have some fun at its expense

                        Mmn, now I see what you mean. :/

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                      ‘Call a spade a spade’ is not a dog whistle and never has been a dog whistle. It’s a common phrase, used all over the world.

                      I’ve downvoted you for trolling, because there’s absolutely no way you are unaware that ‘call a spade a spade’ is a common term with no racist implications. You’re flamebaiting and trolling and should go to HackerNews where this kind of discussion belongs.

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                        ‘Call a spade a spade’ is not a dog whistle and never has been a dog whistle.

                        It’s become a dog whistle through usage of “spade” as a term for Black people, and is undeniably questionable at best, and, in the context of an over-the-top hyperbolic attempt to make Liberals look like lunatics, must be interpreted in that fashion.

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                          ‘Spade’ is not a term for black people, and is not ‘questionable’. Nobody is talking about ‘liberals’ either.

                          Stop assuming everyone shares your ridiculous American political ideas.

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                            ‘Spade’ is not a term for black people, and is not ‘questionable’.

                            I’ve just demonstrated otherwise.

                            Stop assuming everyone shares your ridiculous American political ideas.

                            And now you’ve tipped your hand, troll.

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                              Turns out that even within a single language, words can have meanings that change by period, context or location. Shocking, I know.

                              1. [Comment removed by moderator pushcx: Personal insults are over the line. It's clear you two will never agree, so move on.]

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                                  Don’t get hysterical.

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                        Key quote:

                        An honest discussion of the technologies involved would highlight the importance of context to deciding which tools to use.

                        I often forget that many people aren’t honest. Fact of life.

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                          A little more telling:

                          It’s become increasingly clear that the “debate” about CSS is not about technology. It’s about gender privilege and exclusion.

                          This article started out in a place I could get behind, and then…went somewhere else entirely.

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                            Maybe I read it with a bit more charity but it seems rather clear to me that the CSS vs React/JavaScript debate often reduces to a personal power struggle, not a discussion of technical merits and trade offs.

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                              Just like the discussion on these kinds of posts.

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                          There are already wonderful comments about the various logical problems with this piece, so I won’t repeat those arguments. Instead I’ll point out that men did not push women out of the field. At some point the field changed to where the old jobs, like programming large computers by hand, were no longer relevant. Men did not push women out, the jobs changed substantially and the women of the time were too busy with their jobs to catch up.

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                            Front-end development is a part of the field that has historically been at least slightly more accessible to women.

                            This is false. Women are systematically different from men in ways that make women more interested than men, on the margin, at pursuing visual-design roles, which sometimes fade into frontend web development roles.

                            But the incredible success of the web is based on an architecture of least power, taking advantage of how many more machine optimizations can be made around the less powerful languages of HTML and CSS.

                            This is also false. The incredible success of the web is most certainly not based on an architecture of least power. It’s based on an architecture of more power - namely, people using Javascript to do increasingly sophisticated things, until the web itself became an application delivery and update platform rather than a content delivery platform.

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                              Women are systematically different from men in ways that make women more interested than men, on the margin, at pursuing visual-design roles, which sometimes fade into frontend web development roles.

                              Do you have any links I could read to learn more about this?

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                                Please don’t turn this website into reddit. The awful meme that it’s okay to start asking people for ‘studies’ and ‘sources’ as soon as you lack the ability to actually respond to an argument on its merits is not a good basis for a website. ‘Oh I don’t have any actual response, I’ll use the default: “[citation needed]”.’

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                                  Check your PMs.

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                                The web became incredibly popular long, long before Javascript became prominent. The web has lost importance as Javascript has become more prominent, losing its position to mobile platforms handedly.