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While the content doesn’t seem entirely in line with what people expect to read here, the visualization of various sizes (and practical what-fits-what arrangements) are something I think you will want to see.

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    Imagining a time where I can go to the local maker space and print some open source garments that I have modified to have larger pockets.

    In the present, I just stick to what works and get a lot of stuff from the same brand, since I know it fits me and my essential items well.

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      Programmable sewing machine would be quite amazing.

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        http://softwearautomation.com/li-fung-announce-partnership-softwear-automation/

        Softwear’s revolutionary digital t-shirt SEWBOT® Workline is fully autonomous and requires a single operator, producing one complete t-shirt every 22 seconds…

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          Found this as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXFUqCijkUs Seems like clothes would have be ‘re-architected’ for this method.

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            Why would they need to be rearchitected? The video doesn’t seem to point to that directly.

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              Not all clothes are assembled from fabric panels that stack neatly on top of each other, consider the crotch of the common pants, or double inner seam of jeans.

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          Ha, there’s actually some work on this, I think there’s a DARPA project as well, robotic garment assembly. I’ve given this topic a lot of thought myself. Robots can wield, why not sew?

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        I love to see how both Google and Samsung completely miss the mark with the size of their mobile phones. There were clearly not enough woman involved in the development of those phones.

        My partner puts hers into a second separate pouch on a belt which she wears specifically to solve this problem. She hates large handbags and she does need the larger phone for power and usability. Sometimes she adds a photo camera to her belt too, because it still takes the better pictures. And it doesn’t look shabby at all, but it took her a long time to find something stylish that was also functional.

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          I love to see how both Google and Samsung completely miss the mark with the size of their mobile phones. There were clearly not enough woman involved in the development of those phones.

          How did they miss the mark though? Their phones sell very well and people clearly want the bigger size. It’s the pants companies that missed the mark or maybe the consumers who keep buying pants that don’t suit their needs.

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            How did they miss the mark though? Their phones sell very well and people clearly want the bigger size. It’s the pants companies that missed the mark or maybe the consumers who keep buying pants that don’t suit their needs.

            Well, it’s not like the size of pockets in women’s clothing, has changed significantly over the last 20 years. In my daily life I see a lot of women still using their iPhone SEs or Samsung Galaxy S3 minis and older smaller phones. When I ask them about this, the argument always goes like this: “I do want a newer and better phone, but they are so big! If only I could carry them around without a purse!”. When I reply: “Don’t you have pockets?” the reply to that is usually something along the lines of: “But bigger pockets make my pants look baggy!”.

            Up to this point, you could still argue that it’s the fault of clothing manufacturers, but all changes once you take a closer look at women’s bodies, clothing and how the two of them fit together. Once you’ll do, you’ll realise that it’s a (not so) simple matter of geometry. Women’s hips and behinds are usually more curved then men’s. Where men can fit a large flat 5,5” phone, women usually can’t without fearing that they’ll bend or break it at some point. Also most men don’t care that they have somewhat more bulgy pockets, while for many woman this is an absolute showstopper.

            I should also note that while my partner does have the average women’s body, but she doesn’t have the average women’s attitude towards technology because she also is a software engineer in daily life. From other women, she often gets the question “Don’t you think your phone is a little on the large side of things?”. If the situation allows it, she replies by opening an ssh-session and showing other women that you’ll need the size to conveniently type the commands, but that is also the only reason she didn’t settle on a smaller phone.

            Men usually just ask her: “Hey! Do you have that phone? I’m considering to buy that one as well! Can I have a look?”.

            So to sum things up: Women do want bigger, better and faster phones. If only they could make it work in daily life and it’s not only a matter of just putting bigger pockets in clothing. The aesthetics and socal aspects play a huge role for the other gender as well, which gives you contradictory objectives to solve for.

            Note: My experiences might just be due to the area of Europe I live in, but over here, it’s a pretty obvious issue which has largely been overlooked by 2 of the 3 big phone manufacturers.

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              It sounds like these woman have a conflict of interest. You either use a small phone, buy pants with big pockets or use a handbag. I acknowledge the social aspects at play but if you won’t buy pants with large pockets or a handbag then you will have to buy a small phone. And there is nothing wrong with small phones, I personally find many of todays phones too big. My thumb can’t reach half the screen on some of these new phones.

              I think the big phone OEMs would have looked at this and decided that adding an extra range of phones for small pants pockets won’t sell enough to make it worth it.

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                I would not phrase it as a conflict of interest, but rather as modern smartphones being blatantly oversized and having terrible usability. Don’t forget that it’s women that make about 80%, and have a strong influence on more than 95% of all consumer decisions. Reading the market wrong and building products that most of them are physically unable to use in a comfortable manner due to the size of the product and the physical size and shape of the bodies of such a large and powerful group of end users could be a deadly sin for an OEM.

                Women do need bigger pockets in the literal sense, but the purpose of this thread was to get the idea across that finding clothing with bigger pockets is often very hard, if not impossible. I’ve previously elaborated that even if they can find clothes with bigger pockets, bigger devices don’t fit into those pockets because of the physique of women’s bodies. I’ve combined that with my own observations and concluded that, even if the OEMs have looked into this, they are hitting the wrong notes with a very large group of potential customers and I still think the clickable animations in the article of the original post show this in a very neat way.

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          Pockets, unlike purses, are hidden, private spaces.

          This seems backwards. One’s bag does a much better job of concealing the outline and even the presence of objects.

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            Yes but then you need to carry a bag, which most men don’t need too. Many men may carry a bag to work, but going to dinner or the game on the weekend most men will not be carrying anything outside of their pockets.

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            As a man who had to wear boys’ pants (trousers) for much of his adult life, I feel the same way – for an equivalent waist size, boys’ pockets are usually smaller. I suspect the reason is because boys have shorter arms than men for a given waist size. If the pockets are too deep, then it’s awkward to retrieve small objects from the pockets. I wonder if something similar is true for ladies’ jeans.

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              Cool visualisations, although I wonder how well they’ll work without Javascript or on mobile. Kudos to them for adding ‘Heads up, you’re about to experience some scroll-driven animations. If you’d like to skip that, you can jump ahead to the final state.’

              The issue itself is pretty funny. There are some pretty obvious solutions, like buying jeans with bigger pockets. I suspect the reason is relatively simple: pockets are needed less when most women carry a bag with them everywhere they go, while most men don’t.

              Probably better not to have too many gender politics posts here tho.

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                My wife carries bags mostly because pockets on women’s clothes are ridiculous and because your solution while theoretically sound, fails miserably in practice if you cannot find such clothes.

                This issue might be funny to you, but at this point is just frustration for her and to be honest for me too.

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                  it works wonderfully on mobile

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                    Do you have good tips for women jeans with big pockets?

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                    It’s funny, because I googled “why women pants no pocket” to figure out why this is the case and the first result says that it’s because men who dominate the fashion industry don’t want women to have pockets.

                    Why don’t all the women who want pockets get together, start a company to make highly-pocketed pants, tap this unmet demand and make billions? You know, scratch your own itch and all.

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                      Since when it’s that easy to start a company? Not any kind of company, a factory of mass production.

                      That’s a very immaterial look at the subject.

                      Our status quo is patriarchal. Besides an 8h job, which pay less compared with men, women are the ones that do the housekeeping and child care. Now women should simply start a factory to make these billions.

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                        Oh come on. There are plenty of women who own and operate their own businesses. And women are having kids later and marrying later, meaning more free time to start a company.

                        And you don’t have to start with a giant production. In fact, men don’t start that way either. You start small and grow.

                        And the wage gap has been debunked so many times that it’s absurd to even bring it up.

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                          Oh come on. There are plenty of women who own and operate their own businesses. And women are having kids later and marrying later, meaning more free time to start a company.

                          And you don’t have to start with a giant production. In fact, men don’t start that way either. You start small and grow.

                          The logic you are using is women should sacrifice even more of their time to solve, in local scale, a global scale systemic problem.

                          And the wage gap has been debunked so many times that it’s absurd to even bring it up.

                          It’s not absurd to bring it up at all, because it’s real:

                          Gender gap per country, The Global Gender Gap Report 2017, World Economic Forum, page 8

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                            The logic you are using is women should sacrifice even more of their time to solve, in local scale, a global scale systemic problem.

                            Well, yes. That’s how businesses on average work. This is also how local change tends to go…ye olde “make a cup of tea instead of boiling the ocean”.

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                              The logic you are using is women should sacrifice even more of their time to solve, in local scale, a global scale systemic problem.

                              Are women unable to solve their own problems? Why do you need men to solve it for you? Why do you think that men have some amount of free time that women don’t? The lack of availability of a product you want is not a systemic problem. Men are not keeping you from making this product in any way.

                              Regardless, women can use market pressure to solve the problem, if the demand is as high as some say it is. If a small business proves the demand for these jeans, the global retailers will quickly follow suit. Seems simple enough.

                              It’s not absurd to bring it up at all, because it’s real

                              I took a look at the report. The plot on page 8 does not show a wage gap, rather it is a chart showing the Global Gender Gap Index, an index which takes into account many more factors than income/wage. The index that you should have pointed me to was The Economic Opportunity and Participation subindex, described on page 5. From the name, we can already tell is is too broad to determine whether or not there is a wage gap for people doing the same job at the same level of experience. If we look at the definition of this subindex, we find that we are actually interested in the remuneration gap. However, the term “remuneration” and variations thereof are only mentioned in 3 places in the article, and there is no data on this gap specifically.

                              If we look at the page on the United States, we find a section called Wage Equality for Similar Work, which may be what we are looking for. This data comes from the WEF Executive Opinion Survey, 2017.

                              From the intro:

                              the Executive Opinion Survey is the longest-running and most extensive survey of its kind, capturing the opinions of business leaders around the world on a broad range of topics for which statistics are unreliable, outdated, or nonexistent for many countries.

                              So we see that this data is merely the opinion of the people who run these companies, and is not hard data (this much was admitted in the Gender Gap Index as well). If you want to be sure of this, here is link to the survey itself, which shows that it is only a survey of opinions. Check out question 11.18.

                              So I don’t think this report contains proof that men and women doing the same work at the same level of experience earn a different amount of money.

                              While it is true that the average man earns more than the average woman globally, this is explained by many factors, some of which are listed on the wikipedia page. Here is an article that explains how these various factors affect the pay gap. There are many others like it.

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                                It is a systemic problem, because historically women have been restricted from economically dominant positions, for being women. The factors (discrimination, motherhood penalty and gender roles) in the Wikipedia article that you linked are examples of this systemic problem. But, I could’ve been more clear is that I’m not saying that women can’t solve their own problems, but that the first post “Why don’t all the women who want pockets get together…” has an intonation that completely disregards the responsibility of men and patriarchy in this. And put the whole responsibility on women.

                                I know the index is not only wage, but I wasn’t mentioning only wage in my previous posts. I agree with you this study is not the proof. But, it covers more countries than any other study that I’ve seen, especially Global South, which have a completely different reality than Global North countries, and why the “if you want to change this, you should just open a company that does the way you want” argument lack materialism.

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                        Do you really carry anything in your pockets? I find it very uncomfortable.

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                          Yes and my wife would like to too.

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                            Of course I do. It may not be very comfortable, but unlike an external bad, it doesn’t restrict your movement, and that’s a big advantage.

                            The article is aice data collection and visualization effort.

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                              A “mobile” phone in a pocket surely restricts my movements, especially sitting. Personally sometimes I use a briefcase just for my phone and keys. It’s heavier but you may put it on your knees. Also it looks better than stuffed pockets. Article and presentations are very nice indeed.

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                                For the briefcase you need one hand, ot you need to be sitting in order to put it on your lap. I intentionally choose phones that fit in a pocket comfortably, and I’m not happy with that stupid trend of phone size increasing to the point when even men’s pockets are not enough.

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                              I carry my phone, phones, house keys, work keycard and tissues, I wouldn’t survive with women’s pockets.

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                                I usually add a wallet and a small bottle of alcohol-based hand sanitizer which is really great if you are eating something on the go.

                                I’d like to add that roughly one in 15 people worldwide has a form of diabetes and that a large portion of them also carries medication and a sugary and a salty snack as treatment.

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                                Not if the pocket is deep enough. I have pants that I can fit my phone in the pocket and it’s no issue because the phone sits lower on my leg.

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                                Something I don’t understand is that this isn’t how capitalism is supposed to work. If there exist enough women who are willing to pay for pants with larger pockets then they’ll be made, won’t they?

                                I’ve also heard many of my female friends complain about their tiny pockets, maybe I’m in a bubble and most women don’t mind? Maybe my friends keep trying pants with larger pockets and not buying then because they don’t look stylish enough? Maybe there’s a global conspiracy? I’m having a hard time deciding which of these options is most likely to be true.

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                                  It’s probably a disconnect between what people complain about and what they buy. I heard fake pockets make pants look slimmer so when a designer adds large pockets they sell less of that design even though thats what people say they want.

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                                    Presumably the women in question care more about looking good than carrying things.

                                    The women I know who have different priorities wear different clothes–as do the men I know.

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                                      Then thats just the market working as normal. There will be no shift to more useful clothing if people don’t buy that even if they complain to others after buying it.

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                                        I speculate that people who care about the appearance (rather than functionality) of clothes buy more clothes.

                                        If that effect exists, how strong is it? Do 10% of people buy 90% of clothes?

                                        I heard it is like that for booze: 10% buy 90%. And it ain’t top shelf…

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                                    I found this article really interesting since I had no idea the problem existed. I think maybe the suppliers dont either. The stuff they make that’s slimmer or lighter in pockets sells the most. When Im in Walmart or Target, the heavier stuff isn’t what people are trying on. They might have noticed this eventually modifying supply practices to sell attributes majority were buying.

                                    Another thing thing comes to mind is that each piece of clothing has multiple attributes. Women probably buy something that looks and feels nice despite smaller pockets they don’t like. However, a simplistic analysis of purchasing data might count those sales as a yes to all three. They mighy think small pockets are in demand even though they didnt matter. Then, start putting them on more clothing.

                                    In any case, there’s certainly an unserved need in the market. Smaller suppliers with a proven design/style should consider making a version of each with bigger pockets. A big uptick in sales of those might cause larger suppliers to follow suit.

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                                    My wife and I have noticed this. She lists over the pockets that are just smattered all over my cargos. Even my regular pants generally have pockets. Many of her pants and skirts have stitched up pockets or stitching to look like pockets. What the heck!

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                                      The ‘stitched up’ pockets might be referred to as ‘fake pockets’ elsewhere in this thread.

                                      There are some sewed-shut pockets that can be cut open and made functional without damaging the garment, but I’ve only observed this in men’s formal wear.