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    Is there not a “batteries included” Node framework like Rails yet? I haven’t had the need to look for one but the Rails pattern has been popular in other languages I’ve used (Like CakePHP, for example). My experiences with Node have been good, but almost entirely been “small script that calls AWS” or “single function execution in AWS Lambda.”, or “small Express application that generated PDFs”.

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      I don’t think any languages have had breakout all-in-one Rails-style fullstack frameworks since Django. Basically since Sinatra came out (2007!), everything has been Flask or Express-like routers that connect together little pieces. Maybe it’s time for another megaframework to come out, but I sort of doubt it. I think the market has spoken and people want to be able to connect together small pieces instead of getting something omakase.

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        Pheonix is closer to the “batteries included” mentality IMO

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          I think the market has spoken and people want to be able to connect together small pieces instead of getting something omakase.

          JavaScript, and npm in particular, have chosen this as their ethos: lots of little moving parts tied together manually. Think of the typical node_modules directory with 1000+ packages for a “hello world” app. Java has been the same way.

          The Ruby/Rails ethos has always been more human-focused: we’ll trade RAM/CPU and fine grained control for a developer experience that is fast and easy. Omakase.

          I agree with you: the JS ecosystem will never see a megaframework in widespread use because it goes against the ethos of the community.

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            Phoenix in Elixir and most certainly Laravel in PHP both come to mind.

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              I think the market has spoken and people want to be able to connect together small pieces instead of getting something omakase.

              I don’t agree - it’s not a market-driven opinion so much as it’s REALLY REALLY hard to both provide a good omakase-style framework AND get the necessary adoption within an ecosystem to reach rails-like status. It’s not that people don’t want it, as evidenced by the continued success of Rails. There’s luck involved in being in the right place at the right time providing the right developer experience - it’s hard to capture that purposefully, and that’s why we don’t see a lot of it. I might be able to twist my perspective into defining that as a market justification, but it’s not because it’s what PEOPLE want, it’s how the market incentives align.

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                I think the market has spoken and people want to be able to connect together small pieces instead of getting something omakase.

                I hope so, but given the number of one-page rails apps and rails-like frameworks always popping up (there are several for PHP, several for Haskell, etc) I’m not so confident.

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                Is there not a “batteries included” Node framework like Rails yet?

                I’m surprised the author did not address this as well. There are definitely full stack frameworks like Next.js and Alelph for React and Nuxt.js for Vue. Then there are also various DBaaS providers like Supabase and Fauna that can take the place of the back-end of a traditional Rails app. I’m sure I’m missing others. I admit I’ve only tinkered with these batteries-included options myself. I’m not sure what it would be like to use them in production.

                If the author had reason for dismissing them, I would like to know what it was. Otherwise the comparison is not particularly useful.