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    Apple is Listening mac marco.org

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    The Mac might be back, but Mac OS itself is on life support. Literally nothing useful to pros has happened to that OS for years, and their iCloud offering continues to be poor. Remember when Steve Jobs would walk out and show feature this and iPhoto that and banners which read “Redmond, start your photocopiers”? It seems like Apple would benefit spending time taking cues from Windows for Mac OS nowadays. For my home driver, I put Windows on my 2012 Macbook Pro and have generally been happier. Windows Subsystem for Linux works as advertised, I can stream my Xbox, access to PC games and web browsers are quick.

    Disclaimer: I work for Google, but I am a big fan of Chrome OS for Pros. Local Linux apps, very few crashes, automated security updates, ability to just toss it out and get a brand new one set up exactly as it was just by logging in (sans the Linux apps AFAIK). If you need more power/uptime, get yourself a cheap VM from your preferred cloud and SSH to it and/or mount the remote drive. Literally the only limitation I bump into which grinds my gears is the inability to install fonts without switching to developer mode.

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      What makes MacOS useful to me as a ‘pro’ is it not changing the UI of everything every minor release, not making me think about drivers or updates (that might break stuff), not being prone to malware, respecting my privacy (and that of my company).

      Linux with KDE on a ThinkPad is similar in these respects.

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        What makes it useful for me is that all the software I want to use exists on the Mac and not on Linux; and I can’t stand using Windows. I could probably survive on Windows, I guess, but I’m glad I don’t have to. The fact that, even among all the options, and even with the neglect and sometimes outright malice that Apple treats the Macintosh with, it remains by far the most amenable system for me to use.

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          I mainly talk to people in real life or on Slack, but when I’m on a computer I’m doing email, calendar, wiki, ticket systems, interacting with technical and organisational systems… all this just needs a browser. I hack on stuff mainly in a terminal window, but also pull up various JetBrains tools and VS Code when they are helpful.

          OmniFocus is the only Mac only tool I am currently relying on but that’s okay - I can migrate onto something else if I have to switch away from MacOS one day.

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            I use no web applications, save for Slack; I live in platform native software. I use Logic and Lightroom and Garage Band. All of these are replaceable, or available on Windows in some form; but I don’t have to switch, so I’m not going to. Besides, I still like the Mac.

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            I suspect you have a better answer than I did, but I used to think this, and then I asked myself - what software am I actually using that only exists on the Mac?

            For me, the answer was - aside from VERY occasionally twiddling with Garageband or Quartz composer, exactly none. However your mileage almost certainly varies.

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              Logic, Garage Band. Reeder, my RSS reader. Things, my to-do/reminder app. Fantastical. Lots of small, quality-of-life apps as well.

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                Logic Pro is indeed a fine example of a Mac only app, as is Things. Both are excellent examples of finely crafted Mac UI as well.

                I don’t really use any of that. To be honest they only thing I’d vaguely miss moving to Linux wholesale is Alfred :)

                I wish you luck and hope that Apple continues to support the workflows you use for many years to come.

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                  I wish you luck and hope that Apple continues to support the workflows you use for many years to come.

                  Thank you! Me too.

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          I totally agree. Microsoft, love them or hate them, are innovating like crazy in the developer space - and the Linux space as well!

          Whether you use ChromeOS or an honest to god native Linux I think a lot of developers are starting to reconsider whether or not MacOS X is still giving them any meaningful advantage.

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            The one critical advantage of it – is that it can run OS-X without issue. If you want to carry a single box and do Windows & Linux & Mac development – you got one real pick.

            There are various ways to kludge it – from hackintosh to MacinCloud, but none of them feels that nice.

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              Oh absolutely if you’re doing OSX or IOS platform development there’s no substitute. The hackintosh route seems more trouble than it’s worth, and for many methods you still need to maintain at least one Mac so you can get bonafide access to Apple’s ecosystem.

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            Do you have any materials on great workflows for development on ChromeOS? I’ve been considering going this route – using ChromeOS as a terminal, SSH into cloud servers that I can suspend when I’m not using them, etc. – but have been too busy being productive to devote time to such a massive workflow change.

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              No, not really. It’s pretty trivial, it’s exactly how you said.

              Honestly, I’d get a cheapo Chromebook from Costco, try it for a week or so, then reformat and take it back. Then you get to see what you think and if you like it, get a good one.

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                My Chromebook is a little bit more than 3 years old! I’ve just never took it down this path because of I’ve used it mostly as a souped-up tablet reading experience.

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                I wasn’t terribly impressed by any Chromebook offerings until I picked up a Lenovo Yoga C630 on a whim. It has a nice big screen, a remarkably good touchpad, and a respectable keyboard. My original intention was to see if I could get Linux running natively without too many problems. I figured worse case I could flip the dev-mode switch and tool around with that, but then I discovered Crostini and was immediately sold. You can basically spin up distro-specific Linux containers within new Chrome tabs - way more convenient than dev-mode or ssh’ing into a cloud server.

                Rather than going with a cheap Chromebook, do a little research first and see if the book you’re looking at supports Crostini and give that a shot. I’m a windows dev by day, but I otherwise live on an MBP and rely on it for side projects. I can easily see swapping out my MBP for something like the C630 as an alternative.

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                  It looks like my trusty but aging ASUS Chromebook Flip C101PA has Crostini support so maybe I’ll give it a shot sometime.

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              Consumer product lineup navalgazing is pretty well covered by other places no?

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                You’re right. This kind of thing is probably skirting the off topic line for lobsters, and engenders a lot of low signal high noise discussion around favorite platforms.

                eyes himself guiltily

                Thinking about it. This may be the first tag I actually hide. I’m not, if I’m honest with myself, all that interested in the Mac platform at all anymore.

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                Well, they must be listening to people who have way more money than me.

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                  I think the OP is most excited that Apple is listening at all.

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                    I am in the same boat as you are. It seems that Apple is listening to people who are are fine paying 3x premium for their branded hardware.

                    When the 3x premium is expected from parents of school kids… this seems even more out-of-line with reality.

                    On another hand, may be I am just a bit jealous that I am very far, financially, from being able to afford a couple of Iphone Xs and the new new desktop.

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                      Apple has always been the brand that forces you to pay a premium, but in the past the expectation was that things Just Worked and you got a fully vetted ecosystem that you could rely on.

                      Or that was the marketing anyway :)

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                        I agree, but now we’re talking one hell of a premium (e.g. 1000 USD for the Apple Pro Display XDR STAND!!!)

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                          I’m considering a new laptop for (among other things) photo editing and frankly, there’s really no Windows-based machine that’s as (relatively) affordable as Macbooks - https://www.notebookcheck.net/The-Best-Notebook-Displays-As-Reviewed-By-Notebookcheck.120541.0.html

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                            The market may overlap slightly with people who are willing to pay thousands on a handbag.

                            We are engineers. We are not expected to understand this.

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                        I’ll believe they’re listening when they offer the older style keyboard switches as an option.

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                          The only company that can make computers for our OS seemed incapable of making good computers anymore.

                          Zero sympathy here, to be honest. Don’t use proprietary software; we’ve known this for decades and this is just one more example. If 10% of the effort (or money!) spent developing and purchasing tools to make Mac OS more like GNOME Shell and KDE were spent making GNOME Shell and KDE (and the underlying userspace) more stable and well-supported, Mac OS would be obviated.

                          Apple is listening again, they’ve still got it, and the Mac is back.

                          For now, maybe. What’s going to happen to all the Mac users in 5 to 7 years when they screw it up again? For that matter, what about those keyswitches, which are still an absolute disaster?

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                            Thought this would be about how their little FBI lawsuit was PR theater.