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    I’d prefer the Linux community instead pushed Discord users to Matrix or back onto IRC or XMPP. I understand trying to support where the masses are, but at what cost when user privacy is at stake? There’s nothing open about Discord and they’ve actively shutdown every project that tried to build CLI or alternative clients which against the spirit. The games played can be closed source because they don’t contain all of your private communications–that sort of stuff should be fully open (and ideally end-to-end encrypted).

    Otherwise, I just agree with a sibling that users should keep it in the browser sandbox instead of Electron. It’s a shame Mozilla shutdown SSB before almost anyone knew about it to have PWAs. Users should be pushing back on communities standardizing on Discord as well.

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      That’s a nice sentiment, but it does nothing to help combat the network effect that is why Discord is so irreplaceable.

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        Lucky for me, the communities I participate aren’t limited to Discord and if they were, I just won’t join (and have raised a complaint with ones I’ve considered joining).

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          That’s what people said about Windows, and AIM, and ICQ, and MSN, and …

          If a product’s main value is its network effect, then it is extraordinarily vulnerable to disruption by a genuinely more valuable competitor. This is why Discord is so hostile to CLI / alternative clients.

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            ….nor the practical reasons why people use it.

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              What are those practical reasons, aside from the network effect?

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                The fact compared to XMPP or IRC (as mentioned in parent comment), features like rich text, media uploads, calls, push notifications, message carbons, etc. are there (unlike IRC) and work consistently (unlike XMPP).

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                  And compared to modern FOSS software like Matrix or Zulip?

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                    Not to mention what’s mentioned seem mostly like progressive enhancements certain IRC clients do support. Or are easy to supplement with other dedicated FOSS services. Mumble still works—as does Jitsi and Jami.

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                      Not to mention what’s mentioned seem mostly like progressive enhancements certain IRC clients do support.

                      I’m a bit jaded after many of the people I knew who worked on IRCv3 gave up after the benefits failed to materialize in any tangible way for users.

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                      Matrix has many of its own issues (clients with confusing UX, servers that consume resources, seeming general focus on features over polish). Zulip I actually respect, but the workflow is extremely polarizing.

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              Matrix, IRC, and XMPP are protocols not platforms. While I like some of these protocols, you can’t “push users to IRC” you need to “push them the libera.chat and Thunderbird” or whatever actual platform you are going to promote to them.

              The benefit of an open protocol is that we don’t all have to push the exact same platform so long as they are compatible, but “use XMPP” is like saying “use SMTP” – ok, but how and where do I use this thing? Discord could federate any time it wants to and they wouldn’t even have to leave to “use XMPP” so while that specific thing is unlikely, I do think when doing advocacy the advocate has to pick product/platform winners and not just vague tech.

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                I don’t think this is the “Linux community”, just people who happen to run linux but don’t have stake in the game or are too dumb to relealize that they do.

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                I’ve basically stopped trying to use the desktop versions of electron apps like discord; I just use the website. For that matter, I have the server portion of element-web running in a docker container on my laptop just so I don’t have to run an electron process for it.

                There’s obviously something compelling about being able to package up a web app as a “desktop app,” but I’m wondering if the desktop browsers supporting the various technologies that go under the heading of PWAs wouldn’t be a better fit.

                This doesn’t necessarily go for things like vscode, which actually do things that aren’t just talk to a web server. But even there, it’d be nice not to have to spawn a whole separate browser.

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                  That’s not helpful for many of us as the web app lacks the single most important feature - push to talk.

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                    You can set up a local mic mute push-to-talk hotkey which solves this issue and works for all programs on your computer.

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                      honestly it boggles my mind that people sell microphones that don’t have this implemented in hardware. what the hell people.

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                      I’m not sure such a feature could work in Wayland, as it requires a global hotkey. Perhaps it would be ideal to have it as a system function instead, where your microphone device is muted unless you hold the key.

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                    Using Discord should just plain stop.

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                      Is there a Discord alternative without distracting emojis, media uploading that encourages floods of memes, or twee gamer branding that forces itself upon the UI?