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      Bigger reason is we don’t need their algorithms. What we need are more solid, OSS implementations of protocols and algorithms we have plus tools for automating as much analysis as possible. Despite their BS, I do thank the NSA’s defensive side (I.A.D.) for funding Galois’ work on Cryptol and other stuff that can help with this goal.


      That’s open-source which is always a good default for security-related things but especially true if NSA funds it. ;) Another they did for FOSS which had some benefit was SELinux which was a Secure Computing Corp and Mitre work. They also give a lot of contracts to companies such as Rockwell-Collins who make secure CPU’s, compilers, code generators, and so on. They do good stuff but not enough FOSS for the public. Thanks to Snowden, we know the motivation for that. (sighs)

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        Bigger reason is we don’t need their algorithms.

        Yes. We certainly have ARX and simple non-ARX algos already. The only distinction is these ciphers ‘scale down’ to terribly insecure block sizes, key sizes, and round counts (32 bit block, 64 bit key, 22 single-ARX rounds), and I haven’t exactly heard the clamor for that from civilians.

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          Well, I was thinking more along the lines of all the cryptographers we have working on algorithms when I said that. We certainly have some specific algorithms already. We’ll have more or just better versions of what we have. We don’t need theirs if it comes down to it. Even Schneier liked them so they’re always on the table. I think, if we got desperate about it, we could take the most efficient ciphers available, put them on an advanced node as an ASIC, and just combine that with whatever needs it using tech that mixes die from different nodes. The complicated one with the crypto is already done with the cost getting pretty marginal. The rest of the ASIC is the IoT stuff on same or cheaper node.

          I know this sounds like work upfront if we look at the whole of the silicon ecosystem. It just seems to me it’s an easier investment of governments just throwing grant money at enabling that tech using existing methods (esp fabs and packagers) instead of inventing better algorithms. I mean, do both across many organizations but we got options before “trust the NSA or have no crypto in IoT” is the option. Hope the elaboration makes more sense.