1. 3

    This reads like an ad for an Ably service.

    1. 14

      So who wants to adopt the lobster for lobste.rs?

      1. 6

        why not zoidberg?

        1. 5

          I’m up for donating to a pool for this.

          1. 4

            Agreed with /u/gerikson, I’m up for a donation pool! Who wants to spearhead it?

            1. 15

              I could put together a pool to try to hit the Silver or Gold level. The link would point back to a note on the about page. There would be no reward for donating besides the warm glow of knowing you’ve helped support an organization that is the source of so much error handling in our code.

              Please take this ad-hoc poll by upvoting the single highest amount you’d donate towards this. Enough support and I’ll put something together. (If you made judicious use of your GPU a few years ago and have cryptocurrency to donate, please select the amount of USD you’d convert it into before sending it because I’m game for a fun lark, not a major project.) (Edit: tweeted)

              1. 59

                10 USD

                1. 17

                  1 USD

                  1. 9

                    50 USD

                    1. 4

                      100 USD

                      1. 1

                        This is in progress.

                        1. 1

                          500 USD

                    1. 10

                      Whoo!

                      To clarify a interaction: If you visit a story page with unread comments, the unread comments get marked as read and removed from the unread page. You will see the time get highlighted in red.

                      1. 5

                        I find it really depressing, but not surprising, that Erlang isn’t getting support but Elixir is. While it is more work to write a library which works for both languages, its upsetting that a company as large as Google chooses not to take the time and effort to. I really hope this doesn’t set a precedent going forward for the Elixir community. Every new Elixir library only provides a library for Elixir where as every new Erlang library provides a library for every language which targets the BEAM vm.

                        1. 1

                          I am just glad that BEAM is getting its day out in the sun, so to speak whether it’s via Elixir or Erlang, but honestly, I find Elixir much more approachable as a beginner. Somehow I feel José Valim figured out how to port “Joy of Programming” from Ruby to Elixir

                        1. 2

                          I have been waiting for this for a while. With a solid FFI system, this has (hopefully) has a chance of replacing a lot of reporting systems floating out there in the world.

                            1. 1

                              Zoidberg is the best :) “By the way, I took the liberty of fertilizing your caviar.”

                            1. 17

                              I would love to see something like this for “Serverless” and lambda-style architecture. I believe these are hyped but have some serious downsides.

                              1. 3

                                I’ve found the criticisms levied at the Actor Model model apply to the serverless architecture. AWS / Google’s offerings link their existing services together to feed a mailbox that your function gets invoked by.

                                1. 1

                                  ….why does that website not display without javascript enabled? it makes no sense to me…

                                  1. 1

                                    Its been converted to a single page app.

                                2. 1

                                  I was curious myself since I haven’t looked at it in a while. It was kind of hard to get results since searching for its issues actually brought up more pro-serverless articles than anti-serverless. My brief Googling found a Not Ready for Primetime article in February 2016, these issues in June 2016, a Challenges of Serverless article in March 2017, a few drawbacks in May 2017, and a Quora answer with a few more gripes.

                                1. 3

                                  Thanks for running this u/elbrujohalcon. It was a super fun two days!

                                  1. 1

                                    Thank you for participating :)

                                    1. 2

                                      Thanks again for throwing it. :)

                                  1. 3

                                    If you just want to connect to a running instance, I have one hosted at minecraft.burnwillows.net.

                                    1. 2

                                      The code to run that was not transferred by /u/jcs when /u/pushcx took over. Its remnants in the codebase were also removed recently, so any new BBS would need some new scaffolding.

                                      1. 7

                                        I’ve took the week off for Thanksgiving to get three things done:

                                        The last item is in the process of driving me slightly crazy. Due to the way that objects are defined, its turning into a bit of a puzzle as to how I can get a representation of the source which allows for easy code generation.

                                        1. 2

                                          When you started the Haskell book, did you have no experience with it or already some? And if little experience, how did that work out for you in terms of understanding enough to read or contribute to a FOSS codebase done in Haskell? I try to get feedback on these things to identify which books are worth passing onto others that ask me for beginner resources. A few people said they liked that one but not much detail.

                                          1. 3

                                            I had a moderate amount of experience with Haskell. My alma mater’s comparative programming class used it for the majority of the assignments.

                                            1. 1

                                              Oh ok. So, do you think it took things a piece at a time enough for beginners or probably start with a different book?

                                              1. 2

                                                I do think it would be an ok book for beginners.

                                        1. 3

                                          Back in school, we spent two days of class time working with this. While an interesting concept, there were a number of mutation operators (LVR IIRC) that we couldn’t use. It also only really teaches how mutation testing works, which isn’t wildly used in industry given the current pitfalls. If your up for reading a book, “Introduction to Software Testing” is a very good and covers all of the concept here plus other testing methods.

                                          1. 1

                                            What were the main pitfalls?

                                            1. 2

                                              Equivalent mutants and the amount of time it takes to get a good setup going.

                                              1. 1

                                                Ok tks.

                                            1. 3

                                              I find it super interesting that you can get most of F# compiling to another target with small chunk of code. It also appears to have a better Fez -> Erlang interop story, than some of the other beam targeting languages.

                                              1. 3

                                                I did submit a PR for https://github.com/lobsters/lobsters/issues/218 today. It sounds like that should help with some of the issues you are having?

                                                1. 2

                                                  I did see that, but I don’t see the connection. Can you elaborate?

                                                  To clarify, the issue is not noticing the comment. I do get email notifications of peter’s comments. The problem arises when I try to click through to respond to them.

                                                1. 151

                                                  Hi jcs,

                                                  In an attempt to preserve a community which has been a large part of our lives for a better part of the last few years, @angersock @pushcx @355e3b @alynpost and a few other of the IRC folks feel that we can take over running the website. @alynpost will be able to provide the hosting in Santa Clara, CA under pgrmr’s infrastructure. @pushcx will assume the role of head administrator and take over the domain name along with the Twitter account. @355e3b and @aleph- will take over the care and feeding of the Rails codebase.

                                                  We will not be making any moderation changes at this time—continuity is the important thing.

                                                  Our transition plan is as follows:

                                                  • @pushcx will take over the domain name and Twitter account; @angersock will also have access to resolve emergencies.
                                                  • @pushcx will set up a GitHub organization to own the repository long-term.
                                                  • @alynpost will provision new hardware.
                                                  • @355e3b and @aleph- will take over the administration of the IRC channel on Freenode.
                                                  • @alynpost will invoice @angersock, @pushcx and @355e3b for the costs of running the server long-term.
                                                  • @pushcx and @alynpost will pick a deadline by which anyone who wants their private messages or email address deleted should request it. Once that date has passed, we will pick a date and time for the migration to occur.

                                                  This is solely to ensure continued hosting and maintenance of the website, and a continuation of the community. Long-term, if the existing moderators wish to step down, @pushcx will be responsible for picking new candidates.

                                                  We would also like to thank you for all of your years of work put into this.

                                                  ― #lobsters IRC regulars (aka the clawlateral committee)

                                                  1. 77

                                                    And I assume @tedu will be in charge of the TLS certificates?

                                                    1. 21

                                                      This comment made me super happy :D - Thanks!

                                                      1. 1

                                                        Joker!

                                                      2. 56

                                                        That sounds like a great plan, thanks for putting that together. I’ll feel better knowing the site will be managed by a group instead of falling all on one person.

                                                        1. 22

                                                          Glad to see your approval. :)

                                                          /u/pushcx should be the central point of contact for the migration deets. We’ll keep the community updated!

                                                          1. 26

                                                            Great! We’re really happy to step up and take good care of a community we love.

                                                            And, for the community: the first update is that I just started an email discussion with me, jcs, and alynpost to handle the technical details of the migration. I’ve migrated barnacl.es a few times, so I’m familiar with the procedure. My guess for a timeline is two weeks, but that’ll be adjusted if needed. I’ll post a comment in this thread when we’ve picked a date or there’s otherwise news.

                                                        2. 18

                                                          This sounds great. I’m thrilled to see people working together on this. :)

                                                          1. 10

                                                            I got back from talking to the people planning out the transition (aleph, push, socky, goodger, alyn, 355, irenes) on Mumble and IRC - they’ve all been wonderful people putting in their best to ensure the community will experience a smooth transition and avoid any turmoil.

                                                            1. 10

                                                              Awesome, glad to have regulars and good people taking things over.

                                                              I would strongly recommend, and as a lobste.rs regular personally request that as a group you take a bit of time to define some basic agreement about decision making and ownership, so that it is clear between you all, and also to the community.

                                                              This is not a problem when there’s one guy in charge - it’s simple and clear and whether you agree with them or not you have consistency and stability (thanks @jcs !)

                                                              When there’s more than one, you need extremely strong value alignment and high levels of trust. If you guys have not known each other for 5+ years and can meet in the same bar to share a beer, you need to talk about and get down some basics. Who makes decisions, how, when; who is in control of the domain / hosting / features / community management.

                                                              Personally, I like the ‘benevolent dictator’ situation. It reduces ambiguity and facilitates short sharp clear decisions. Greater than 2 people needs work to define that recognises that you will eventually have a conflict, that some of you will come and go, and that there is no way you can all have perfect understanding of what each other wants for this community and what your values are.

                                                              Not doing this is a valid choice too; equal to commitment to cede to whoever has ‘root’ and control of the hosting and then domains if a conflict happens, and requiring proactively thinking about forking / commuity splits.

                                                              1. 6

                                                                The way that I personally view it is, @pushcx will step into @jcs’s role and take over as the benevolent dictator.

                                                                1. 2

                                                                  Is that what you’re thinking too @pushcx ?

                                                                  1. 10

                                                                    That’s the current plan I’m executing on, yes. I want to continue this excellent community. Lobsters is in a good place: we have a healthy, active userbase, the code is stable, bug-free, and has little need for new features, and I’m on sabbatical so I have plenty of time and attention to devote to a smooth transition.

                                                                    After the migration is complete I think it’s worth having a new meta thread about if we want to shift to a new community governance model. I’m comfortable being BD for years if not indefinitely, but there’s enough folks talking about community models that I want to have a dedicated discussion to explore examples and consider the option.

                                                                2. 4

                                                                  One of the guiding principles we talked about a lot during the clawlateral committee meeting was that we wanted to stray as little as possible from the existing governance structure for the time being–the site has done well in its current incarnation, and @pushcx is we believe a good steward to carry on the precedent set by @jcs.

                                                                  The plan explicitly has redundancy in roles (think failover) for all important things you mentioned. We also tried to follow a principle of least-trust and a little bit of separation of powers for the failover folks, so that continuity of service is easy but forking and hijacking is hard.

                                                                  1. [Comment removed by author]

                                                                    1. 3

                                                                      So what moderation changes will you make later?

                                                                      The first rule of intelligent tinkering is to keep all the pieces. When we say we will not be making any moderation changes at this time, we mean that we have no moderation changes to make. This group volunteered to operate lobste.rs because we like the way the website has been run. We will moderate with the same principles the site has always operated on. The moderation log is available for public inspection. Changes to the site, just like the one announced here, will be discussed in their own meta thread.

                                                                3. 6

                                                                  Thank you all. I work a lot, don’t know Rails, and don’t really have anything constructive to contribute, but this is far and away the best signal to noise community I’m involved with and I really appreciate it.

                                                                  If throwing money at the problem will help the new maintainers along please consider setting something up and I’ll chip in.

                                                                  1. 4

                                                                    They said they should be able to pay for everything out of pocket, as far as I know.

                                                                  2. 6

                                                                    Does this mean we can finally get an @angersock plushie?

                                                                    1. 2

                                                                      You guys were my first thought when I saw this post lol. Thanks for your continued commitment to the community ~

                                                                      1. 1

                                                                        Thanks @angersock, @pushcx, @355e3b, @alynpost!

                                                                        I’d hate to see lobsters die!

                                                                        1. 1

                                                                          I love how fast this plan was put together and I feel it will be in good hands. I was scared seeing this post and am excited to see the community I love will keep going and be in good hands!

                                                                        1. -3

                                                                          Is the new license text available anywhere? This announcement feels like they have written another custom license and we will be back in the same place in the next six to twelve months.

                                                                          1. 9

                                                                            Are we reading the same announcement?

                                                                            Next week, we are going to relicense our open source projects React, Jest, Flow, and Immutable.js under the MIT license.

                                                                          1. 1

                                                                            I’m on freenode as “c355e3b” if anyone has any questions.

                                                                            1. 2

                                                                              I love how the devops community seems to strive to make local offline development unclear and awkward if not impossible with their tooling. I look at the flow diagram of the deploy and think I get why this exists wearing my sysadmin hat but no developer I try to explain this to is going to actually get super powers by doing this.

                                                                              I cannot help seeing with irony the ‘dev’ in devops. Rarely is energy put into the development process, how to get a local clean environment setup every morning in minutes without any external coordination (ie. instead hand waving to ask a sysadmin for a dumpster dev VM) and provide developers the confidence that what works with the VM technology of their choosing on their workstation will work when deployed to production. For that to happen, you need to make both environments similar, I cannot see how or where todays tooling helps here[1].

                                                                              Solutions, like chef/puppet/‘bakery-stack’, seem to live in a world that once software is written it remains unchanged, or comes through some external “not our problem space” .deb/.rpm/nonsense. I want myself and my colleagues to run through a process limited in speed by only how quickly they use the mouse and keyboard (ie. seconds):

                                                                              • edit code locally on host
                                                                              • deploy to local VM
                                                                              • test
                                                                              • commit and push
                                                                              • deploy to live

                                                                              Salt Stack, the least crap though just as slow of what I have used recently, at least can be run in masterless mode and apply an arbitary state to a local empty VM…and probably with some work in offline mode. Gets me some of the way, but I still am left feeling wanting.

                                                                              I know ancible apparently can do ‘masterless’ too, but the documentation (inc for Salt Stack) is sketchy and the gernal userbase seem unaware of the masterless configuration; if not frowning on it.

                                                                              [1] docker might make local and production the same, but on the flip side it makes the deploy and running in production so god awfully hard, you kind of forget why you bothered in the first place

                                                                              1. 1

                                                                                For local development, Ansible just needs ssh access to the vm and the ability to sudo. Vagrant has a solid integration for automating this process.

                                                                              1. 5

                                                                                If your concerned about remote nodes having direct access to your local computer, you can also access an Erlang node via ssh using ssh:daemon.